{"id":"sn44.6","title":"With Sāriputta and Koṭṭhita (4th)","languageCodes":["en","pi"],"languageNotes":{"en":"Bhikkhu Sujato · CC0","pi":"Mahāsaṅgīti edition · SuttaCentral"},"chapters":[{"id":"sn44.6","title":"With Sāriputta and Koṭṭhita (4th)","units":[{"id":"sn44.6:0","sourceIds":["sn44.6:0.1","sn44.6:0.2","sn44.6:0.3"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"Saṁyutta Nikāya 44.6\n1. Abyākatavagga\nCatutthasāriputtakoṭṭhikasutta","en":"Linked Discourses 44.6\n1. The Undeclared Points\nWith Sāriputta and Koṭṭhita (4th)"}},{"id":"sn44.6:1","sourceIds":["sn44.6:1.1","sn44.6:1.2","sn44.6:1.3","sn44.6:1.4","sn44.6:1.5","sn44.6:1.6","sn44.6:1.7","sn44.6:1.8"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"Ekaṁ samayaṁ āyasmā ca sāriputto, āyasmā ca mahākoṭṭhiko bārāṇasiyaṁ viharanti isipatane migadāye.\nAtha kho āyasmā sāriputto sāyanhasamayaṁ paṭisallānā vuṭṭhito yenāyasmā mahākoṭṭhiko tenupasaṅkami; upasaṅkamitvā āyasmatā mahākoṭṭhikena saddhiṁ sammodi.\nSammodanīyaṁ kathaṁ sāraṇīyaṁ vītisāretvā ekamantaṁ nisīdi. Ekamantaṁ nisinno kho āyasmā sāriputto āyasmantaṁ mahākoṭṭhikaṁ etadavoca:\n“‘kiṁ nu kho, āvuso koṭṭhika, hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’ti …pe…\n‘kiṁ panāvuso, neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’ti iti puṭṭho samāno:\n‘etampi kho, āvuso, abyākataṁ bhagavatā—\nneva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’ti vadesi.\nKo nu kho, āvuso, hetu, ko paccayo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti?","en":"At one time Venerable Sāriputta and Venerable Mahākoṭṭhita were staying near Varanasi in the deer park at Isipatana.\nThen in the late afternoon, Venerable Sāriputta came out of retreat, went to Venerable Mahākoṭṭhita, and they greeted each other.\nWhen the greetings and polite conversation were over, he sat down to one side and said to Mahākoṭṭhita:\n“Reverend Koṭṭhita, does a realized one still exist after death?” …\n“Reverend, when asked these questions, you say that this has not been declared by the Buddha.\nWhat’s the cause, what’s the reason why this has not been declared by the Buddha?”"}},{"id":"sn44.6:2","sourceIds":["sn44.6:2.1","sn44.6:2.2","sn44.6:2.3","sn44.6:2.4","sn44.6:2.5","sn44.6:2.6","sn44.6:2.7","sn44.6:2.8","sn44.6:2.9"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"“Rūpārāmassa kho, āvuso, rūparatassa rūpasammuditassa rūpanirodhaṁ ajānato apassato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti;\n‘na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti;\n‘hoti ca na ca hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti;\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti.\nVedanārāmassa kho, āvuso, vedanāratassa vedanāsammuditassa, vedanānirodhaṁ ajānato apassato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti …pe…\nsaññārāmassa kho, āvuso …pe…\nsaṅkhārārāmassa kho āvuso …pe…\nviññāṇārāmassa kho, āvuso, viññāṇaratassa viññāṇasammuditassa viññāṇanirodhaṁ ajānato apassato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti.","en":"“Reverend, if you like, love, and enjoy form, and don’t truly see the cessation of form, you think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ or\n‘a realized one no longer exists after death’ or\n‘a realized one both still exists and no longer exists after death’ or\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nIf you like, love, and enjoy feeling …\nperception …\nchoices …\nconsciousness, and don’t truly see the cessation of consciousness, you think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’"}},{"id":"sn44.6:3","sourceIds":["sn44.6:3.1","sn44.6:3.2","sn44.6:3.3","sn44.6:3.4","sn44.6:3.5","sn44.6:3.6","sn44.6:3.7","sn44.6:3.8"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"Na rūpārāmassa kho, āvuso, na rūparatassa na rūpasammuditassa, rūpanirodhaṁ jānato passato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti.\nNa vedanārāmassa kho, āvuso …pe…\nna saññārāmassa kho, āvuso …pe…\nna saṅkhārārāmassa kho, āvuso …pe…\nna viññāṇārāmassa kho, āvuso, na viññāṇaratassa na viññāṇasammuditassa, viññāṇanirodhaṁ jānato passato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti.\nAyaṁ kho, āvuso, hetu, ayaṁ paccayo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti.","en":"If you don’t like, love, and enjoy form …\nfeeling …\nperception …\nchoices …\nconsciousness, and you truly see the cessation of consciousness, you don’t think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nThis is the cause, this is the reason why this has not been declared by the Buddha.”"}},{"id":"sn44.6:4","sourceIds":["sn44.6:4.1","sn44.6:4.2","sn44.6:4.3","sn44.6:4.4","sn44.6:4.5","sn44.6:4.6","sn44.6:4.7"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"“Siyā panāvuso, aññopi pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti?\n“Siyā, āvuso.\nBhavārāmassa kho, āvuso, bhavaratassa bhavasammuditassa, bhavanirodhaṁ ajānato apassato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti.\nNa bhavārāmassa kho, āvuso, na bhavaratassa na bhavasammuditassa, bhavanirodhaṁ jānato passato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti.\nAyampi kho, āvuso, pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti.","en":"“But reverend, could there be another way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha?”\n“There could, reverend.\nIf you like, love, and enjoy existence, and don’t truly see the cessation of continued existence, you think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nIf you don’t like, love, and enjoy existence, and you truly see the cessation of continued existence, you don’t think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nThis too is a way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha.”"}},{"id":"sn44.6:5","sourceIds":["sn44.6:5.1","sn44.6:5.2","sn44.6:5.3","sn44.6:5.4","sn44.6:5.5","sn44.6:5.6","sn44.6:5.7"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"“Siyā panāvuso, aññopi pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti?\n“Siyā, āvuso.\nUpādānārāmassa kho, āvuso, upādānaratassa upādānasammuditassa, upādānanirodhaṁ ajānato apassato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti.\nNa upādānārāmassa kho, āvuso, na upādānaratassa na upādānasammuditassa, upādānanirodhaṁ jānato passato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti …pe…\n‘neva, hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti.\nAyampi kho, āvuso, pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti.","en":"“But reverend, could there be another way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha?”\n“There could, reverend.\nIf you like, love, and enjoy grasping, and don’t truly see the cessation of grasping, you think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nIf you don’t like, love, and enjoy grasping, and you truly see the cessation of grasping, you don’t think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nThis too is a way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha.”"}},{"id":"sn44.6:6","sourceIds":["sn44.6:6.1","sn44.6:6.2","sn44.6:6.3","sn44.6:6.4","sn44.6:6.5","sn44.6:6.6","sn44.6:6.7"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"“Siyā panāvuso, aññopi pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti?\n“Siyā, āvuso.\nTaṇhārāmassa kho, āvuso, taṇhāratassa taṇhāsammuditassa, taṇhānirodhaṁ ajānato apassato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa hoti.\nNa taṇhārāmassa kho, āvuso, na taṇhāratassa na taṇhāsammuditassa, taṇhānirodhaṁ jānato passato yathābhūtaṁ, ‘hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti …pe…\n‘neva hoti na na hoti tathāgato paraṁ maraṇā’tipissa na hoti.\nAyampi kho, āvuso, pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti.","en":"“But reverend, could there be another way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha?”\n“There could, reverend.\nIf you like, love, and enjoy craving, and don’t truly see the cessation of craving, you think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nIf you don’t like, love, and enjoy craving, and you truly see the cessation of craving, you don’t think ‘a realized one still exists after death’ …\n‘a realized one neither still exists nor no longer exists after death.’\nThis too is a way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha.”"}},{"id":"sn44.6:7","sourceIds":["sn44.6:7.1","sn44.6:7.2","sn44.6:7.3","sn44.6:7.4"],"kind":"text","text":{"pi":"“Siyā panāvuso, aññopi pariyāyo, yenetaṁ abyākataṁ bhagavatā”ti?\n“Ettha dāni, āvuso sāriputta, ito uttari kiṁ icchasi?\nTaṇhāsaṅkhayavimuttassa, āvuso sāriputta, bhikkhuno vaṭṭaṁ natthi paññāpanāyā”ti.\nChaṭṭhaṁ.","en":"“But reverend, could there be another way of explaining why this was not declared by the Buddha?”\n“Seriously, reverend, what more could you want?\nFor one who is freed due to the ending of craving, there is no cycle of rebirths to be found.”"}}]}],"sourceRevision":"afdafa92450cfe7573b280da50382888323666d2","sourceUrl":"https://suttacentral.net/sn44.6/en/sujato","licence":"CC0 1.0","licenceUrl":"https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/","editionNote":"Full supplied source file; inherited abbreviations are preserved. Not a reconstructed expansion of every repetition. No Malay or Mandarin translation is implied."}